TPP#24 - Plumbing Apprenticeship FAQ

In this episode, I go over some of the most common questions I have been asked about a plumbing apprenticeship.  I review the pros and cons of union, the differences between service, new construction, and commercial, and tips for finding that first apprenticeship and how to stand out. 

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Brandon@ThatPlumbingPodcast.com

Transcript

0:00

hey everyone. And welcome back to that plumbing podcast. I'm Brandon, the plumber, and this is episode 24. Going to college. Apprenticeship frequently asked questions. This episode is a collection of questions that I've received through email and some that I just think apprentices may have when it comes to finding their first apprenticeship.

Brandon: 0:18

So I'm just going to go ahead and jump right in. Should you become a plumber? That's a very great question. And if someone were to come up to me and ask me, should they become a plumber? I would ask them, that depends. Do you like working with your hands or do you like sitting at a desk? Are you good at paying attention and listening and studying or do you have trouble and you can't wait to get out of class? It seems and this used to be a thing in high school where they had vocations where if you were coming up through high school and you just, you weren't going to be a doctor, you weren't going to be a biologist, you weren't going to be like a college bound student, you could take vo tech and you could learn carpentry, plumbing, electrical, different types of skilled trades, and then you could go that route. And there's nothing wrong with that at all. I think a lot of men would really appreciate that option to go and learn how to do something that makes sense, that you can see the results when you're done. You're providing a service that is important. Absolutely. I would recommend getting into plumbing. It can be difficult. It can be tough. It will be difficult. It will be tough. And just starting out, of course you're going to be at the bottom of the totem pole and depending on which state you work in you could be an apprentice up to four years, or you could be, if you're like here in Phoenix, probably out in your truck in six to 12 months, if you're really putting all your effort into it. I would say If college or school doesn't really do it for you Then yes, I would consider plumbing. I would consider any skill trade any blue collar job, but i'm biased So come be a service plumber Next what are the different types of plumbing that you can do? You have service and then you have new construction. You have service, can be residential or service commercial. Service residential, you get a call, you go into a house, a customer's house and you greet them, you build a relationship with them, you talk to them, you get the, you inspect the problem, you transition to inspecting the whole system, you educate the customer, you give them options and let them choose. Commercial service is a little bit different. Most commercial buildings have like a property manager or someone that kind of subcontracts out a plumbing company to go fix things. If their maintenance can't handle it. So that one's a little bit different. That one is not so much customer service base. It's not so much service because if you go out to a business and they have a leaking angle stop, they really just want you to fix that angle. Stop. They don't want you to talk about water filtration and And try and educate them and change out all the angle stops to be preventative. No, they really just, they want to spend as little as possible, get it fixed and and get on your way. A lot of times they have not to exceeds. So if I get a ticket It'll say NTE 500. So that tells me not to exceed 500. So as long as the problem is under 500, I don't even need to talk to anyone. I can just do the repair, take the pictures, get the signature of whoever is in charge on site and that's it. And then the office builds them later. So if you like the idea of going different places every day, new situations, then commercial services might be for you, especially if you're not great with people or that's just not your thing, but you do like service, then you can go into commercial. Next you have new construction. New construction is exactly what it sounds like depending on your company and the contract and all that you are the guy The first one on site. I mean there's dirt there's nothing but a dirt field And then you start at the main or you start at the sewer the city sewer and you literally trench To where the plumbing is gonna go. I have no idea about this construction Because I've never done it, but somehow through voodoo and magic. And if please let me know, come on and tell me how and explain to all of us how this works, but they take measurements. They take the blueprints, they lay out strings, they lay out the fixtures and they plummet all the way to where it needs to be. They come up out the dirt then they come and they pour the slab and the plumbing is going to be sticking up through the slab. And then they will come and they will build the frame and then you come and you run the plumbing it's a whole process a hybrid would be a remodel where maybe it's an existing house, but they want to add a bathroom and it's like a mixture of both. So new construction is if you want absolutely nothing to do with people, all you want to do is show up clock in, do your nine to five or whatever it is, and then clock out. There's no commission. You're just working with the people that you're working with. Now, I would say that service plumbing, after you get out of your apprenticeship. Is a little bit more isolating from your fellow co workers now here. We're working hard to try and alleviate some of that by building a community, but it won't be uncommon for you to be in a truck by yourself most of the day and weeks at a time. And if leadership isn't making the attempt to contact you and you're not contacting anyone else, then you could end up being isolated for some time, whereas New construction, you've always got people around you. Next question, how long does it take to become a plumber? I can tell you that completely depends on your state. And we've gone into this before, I'll just say it again. Some states require you to complete basically a four to five year apprenticeship. Get I think it's 4, 000 hours, 5, 000 hours of direct supervision from a licensed journeyman. before you can quote unquote work on your own. So I would say on the long end, four years before you get your own van or before you can get journeyman's pay. For places like here in Arizona, only the owner of the company needs to be licensed and then he can hire anyone he wants. So it's like a double edged sword. Here in Arizona, We can get you into a van depending on, on your initiative within the first year, I would say six to 12 months. I've heard of guys getting turned loose in, in less than six, which I admit that was the best idea in hindsight, but it is possible and it is completely on you.

6:27

So.

Brandon: 6:28

I would say anywhere from six months to four years, depending on your location. And attitude. Next, how much do plumbers make? A lot. No, I'm just I'm not joking, but they do make a good living wage. Now, again, I can only really truly speak from residential service, but across the field, blue collared workers, skilled trades, our wages are increasing, and there's no sign of them stopping soon until the people listening to this podcast Jump into the field, get, come in apprenticeship, get hired on, tell their friends to do it. And we have a mass wave of guys wanting to get into the field until then. our wages are going to continue to go up. It's supply and demand we just talking about college earlier, back in the what sixties or somewhere around that area, they started pushing college saying, work, work smarter, not harder college guarantees, like a good. a good living wage the house and the kids and the job security and the retirement 401k, all that stuff. That's what college promised us. And I guess it did pay off for a little while, but at this point unless you're going to very specific majors you're not really guaranteed any type of livable wage when you graduate plumber, tradesman, yes, you're going to get a living wage and you're going to have job security and you're going to be pandemic proof. And if you're in service, you're going to be able to set your own income cap. There are guys out there who are in service who are making 150, 000, 200, 000 a year. Now, above that I question if they're doing like salesy stuff, but the point is that definitely the potential is out there. It's good money. 100, 000 should not be a problem. Probably I would say within two years you could be at that mark and that's really just a generic assumption. really is truly up to you. All right. Next question. What will I do in my apprenticeship? In the beginning, you're going to do a lot of grunt work. That's just the nature of the game. It's the way it is. I've done it. Everyone, every plumber's done it. When you start off you're going to be doing the work that doesn't actually require plumbing in service, you've got jackhammer and slabs, digging trenches, crawling through attics, running pipe, running supply lines what else, you got sewer jobs it's gonna be dirty, it's gonna be messy, New construction is definitely where you're going to be taxed the most physically is because like I said, you've, you're digging the trench, you get there and there's just there's just dirt. So you're going to be digging the whole trench. And then throughout the process, you're going to be run the one running the pipe. You should also be getting some sort of education, some sort of technical training. Our company is developing an apprenticeship program. We have the basics. It's you take your classes online, and then you take a test. Apprenticeship. If you're in new construction, you're going to be learning about the different pipe sizes, the different pipe fittings, take off run, mathematical equations, OSHA codes residential that's the thing about service is that most of it is soft skills. It is the people. It is the connection. It is the communication. Service, once you get, like I said, every call is different, but it's the same types of calls. Maybe 10 or so, 10, maybe 15 different types of calls that each house is going to have. Because there's only so much inside of a house. After that point, it's more about refining your your communication skills, your service skills your ability to handle people apprenticeship is really going to vary based on which field you choose within plumbing and also in which state. If you are in the union, you're going to be required to go to school. I think two nights a week is what it was when I was in it. Some states like Louisiana have non union schools that you're still required to go to in order to get your apprenticeship. Here in Phoenix, you're just going to get whatever the company decides to put together. A little bit more informal on the service side, but. Your apprenticeship should be where you're learning how to do things the correct way from a mentor that is willing to teach you and have patience and help you out. Your apprenticeship is very important because you could easily flood a house if you don't know what you're doing. And that's not good. That's very expensive. And actually Josh said this the last episode, he said, plumbing is easy, but being a good plumber is difficult. And, I, first time I heard it. And it's stuck with me and I'm going to remember it forever because it is so true. This whole plumbing thing. Especially if you're in service where the communication is more important than the technical skills Next one, should I go union or non union? I know that this is a hot button topic for some plumbers. I started out union in Louisiana. I did two years, my apprenticeship. I was part of the only service company in the union so I was very fortunate to be able to get that position because the pay was good compared to the non union plumbers at the time this totally depends on where you live. Some people hate them. Some people love them. I say if they're going to hire you and teach you then it doesn't matter if it's union or non union. However, for union, you do need to be aware of some things. One, you're going to have to go to school. You're going to be required to work and go to school for the entire four or five years, whatever it is to get yourself certified. The good news about union is that the Wages are set and as an apprentice, you're guaranteed a pay raise every year as you graduate to the different levels. Then you're set at that pay until contract negotiations come back around and they can increase. Their package now thing about union is that they have good benefits. They have health care Obviously, but health care is actually last I heard is pretty good Because it's included in your pay so it's not like it technically It does come out of your paycheck, but you don't see it if i'm understanding correctly, so There's that then you have your pension where you put so much in every month And then after you do so many years when you retire you get your pension that is huge. I knew guys in the union who just they always talked about their pension and how much they were looking forward to it. And you get your pension plus social security, they were making pretty good money back then with both of those combined. Now the cons of the union is that especially if you're like a new construction with the union, you're going to get laid off eventually because as soon as the project's done, the contracts up, they don't need you anymore is where it's important that if you do decide to go union route, that it's in a state or an area where the union is strong enough to have continuous work. It was not uncommon for me to hear about guys getting laid off and being on unemployment for a few months, six months. Before a new contract come up. So that's something to be aware of Ultimately, I would say that if you are 100 percent set on new construction then consider the union because they're going to pay you well, you're guaranteed raises every year, you're going to school, and then you're setting yourself up for a pension at the end of whatever the years are if you just want to get out there as fast as you can then consider non union, unless you're in a state that requires licensing. Don't let anyone tell you that union's bad, Some guys are so passionate about how much they hate the union, and I just don't get it. If you don't like it, that's cool, go non union. There's no sense in creating all kinds of drama over it alright, this question, will I be messing with poop all day? And I know that's what like the general public sees us as, is always like messing with poop and being covered in, all kinds of waste. I tell you, when I'm messing with a drain line, I do everything I can to not get anything on me. I'm careful, I take off my, work shirt, I wear gloves, I take all the safety precautions, and rarely do I ever get covered in anything that I wasn't expecting. If you are working for a drain company, then your chances of messing with poop is higher, like the rotor rooters and the rootle rangers or the rooter, whatevers companies that specialize in drains. Just by the sheer statistics, you're gonna be coming into more contact with it. So you're going to be messing with it more service. It really depends. It depends because some companies don't really mess with drains or they have a drain division. As an apprentice, you're not going to be able to avoid the drains, it is a dirty job and you do have to be careful. And my best advice would be to keep your mouth closed when you're using a drain machine, because I have. Made that mistake once and never again. But, once you get into your own van, once you get into your own truck, if you don't want to touch drains, you can find companies that have drain divisions, and you never have to touch them again. Some companies specialize in water filtration, or different aspects of plumbing, and you can get into that and not have to mess with drains. But yeah, in the beginning you're going to have to be aware that it's very possible. But just take the right precautions, take your time, think things through, and you will probably not get a lot of poop on you for the most part. Next up, what should I be looking for in an apprenticeship or a company that is offering an apprenticeship? For this one, I would recommend going back to episode 16, if you haven't already, the three red flags of an apprenticeship. I'll just touch back on it, but basically you want to make sure that you're actually learning that you're not just nonstop digging, that you're not never coming in contact with actual plumbing unless that's like what you're hired on as, but if you are interested in actual plumbing, when you're applying for the apprenticeship, ask them the directions that you can go. Ask if they have a drain division. Or where you can expect to go as you progress. You also want to ensure that you have a journeyman or a mentor who is actually willing to teach you. Who is patient with you. Who doesn't belittle you for asking questions or use it as an opportunity to make himself feel better about himself. Because, you gotta watch, there are a lot of these guys in the field still. A lot of them are retiring, but it's not even about like age so much as you get a guy who's just stuck in his head, stuck in his truck for years and years, or maybe his whole career at a time. And he just, he doesn't like, he doesn't like himself. He doesn't like his family. He has all these issues. And then he just takes it out on the apprentice because he knows more than you. And so he's going to use that to make himself feel better. And I talked about this as well. Are you working full time? Is your apprenticeship 40 hours a week, give or take, and you're there learning no matter what. If there's no dig job, you're gone with a journeyman to learn about whatever. If there's no dig job or you're going into the shop to organize the bins you're always staying busy. You're always learning. If you're just coming in here and there for a couple of hours, a couple of days When there's a dig job and then they send you home for two or three days until they get another dig job That's not really an apprenticeship in my opinion. That's more of a laborer and you should probably reconsider working there if Learning plumbing is your goal. The attitude of the company is a big deal recently We started talking about private equity companies in their sell model. I'm going to make a Small exception For these private equity companies, when it comes to your apprenticeship for the simple fact is that you have to have money in order to start an apprenticeship. You have to have extra capital to invest into guys who are just there, just in the beginning, you're just a drain on the company until you can actually start doing work. So if there's a larger company that offers an apprenticeship and that's what your option is. I would consider it because you get your foot in the door, you get your foot in the door, you put it in a year, and then you can switch to a different company, a different apprenticeship. And it'll be so much easier once you have that experience versus when you're coming in and you know nothing the final question is, what do I say in an interview? Or how do I present myself if I'm interviewing for an apprenticeship? What I would say is be early, like 10 minutes or so, be presentable, have yourself put together like you intend to look, how you look

19:11

And

Brandon: 19:12

bring your own pen, because it's little things like that, where you bring your own pen, And the hiring manager sees you and he already thinks Oh he's, he came prepared. No one ever brings a pin. And every time I got to go hunt one down and find a form, this guy brought his own pin. That is like a huge thing. I don't know. That's just, if I saw a potential apprentice do that would automatically be like, Oh, set yourself apart from the other guys who just wander in and the shirts untucked. They're not shaving. They smell like alcohol. They smell like cigarettes or something. Just, they just do whatever you can to set yourself apart, show your eagerness to learn. Express to them that you understand the state of the plumbing industry and you are very eager to join in because you see the potential in the future. You tell them that you want more than just a paycheck. Present yourself as someone that is a long term investment. Look at the person in the eye, the person doing the interview, look at them, pay attention, nod as they speak. Let them know in some way that you're listening to them. Let them lead the conversation. Don't try and sell yourself. If he wants to know something, the interviewer, he's going to ask you, and don't act like you know what he's talking about or what he's saying. One of the things that's like my pet peeve is if I'm trying to explain something to an apprentice, they're going Or you know somewhere I'm supposed to be training them and they just make it seem like they know everything already that I'm saying and it's like dude you can't know everything that I'm saying I'm not trying to prove that I know more than you I'm not trying to prove that you don't know as much I'm just we're going through this together and I'm sharing my experience with you The point is that you Come across as someone who is coachable, who is willing to learn, and then be persistent, be very persistent. Even in the process of getting the first interview I had a guy reach out to me last week and he wanted to know about an apprenticeship. So I directed him to one of the companies that I talk about and he went to it. It was like a hire in event. And I asked him how it went when he was done and he said it went good. He said that they would give me a call back if they wanted to follow up. And I explained to him that's how that company works. They just have a open house. Everyone comes in, they learn about the company. They spend some time getting to know you. And then everyone goes home. Like rarely is anyone ever hired at that particular moment. When I worked for them, they would have guys that would get hired on two months after the interview. But I recommend it to him, follow up with them. if you don't hear anything, go to next month's hiring event. And I know that if I saw another potential apprentice show up twice, then I know he is very serious. He's persistent. He's not just mass applying to all these companies and taking whatever comes in. And it goes for, calling, if you send your email. I've actually done this, I've sent my resume to plumbing companies and then called them right after. Just to let them know, put a voice to the name. I've asked for service managers emails, I've emailed them directly. It's not hard to set yourself apart. You just have to do a little bit more than submitting your resume or your application, I should say, because you don't have a resume yet or if you're older, you might have a resume, but you just, you show a little bit more initiative than the next guy and you're going to be way ahead of anyone else. Trust me. This is absolutely the best time to get into the plumbing field. And it's, just little things like I said that you can do that really set yourself apart. The money's there, the future's there, the benefits are there. It's all there waiting for you to just go and grab it. Get through your apprenticeship and then you're good, you're set. For the rest of your life, potentially, you can go anywhere in the country, any city, any town, anywhere you go with civilization needs plumbing, and then you have it, and you have security, and if you can always fall back on it if you find something else so if you're an apprentice, and you are thinking about becoming a plumber you probably should because people who don't think about it and I'll just leave you with this. Because I know some of you might be thinking I never wanted to be a plumber. I don't want to be a plumber. I'm going to be just a plumber for the rest of my life. And I'm here to say that's okay to think that it doesn't mean you shouldn't be a plumber. It just means that you're thinking long term and that's awesome. When I was in my apprenticeship, plumbing just happened to me as it does with pretty much everyone that I've talked to. I needed money fast. I was actually just out of rehab for alcohol, and I was at a halfway house and so I needed money fast, like the day of, so I could just start getting stuff back together, getting my life back together. And I got on with a temp agency and they sent me with this plumbing company who needed me to dig out a slab, use a jackhammer. Never touched a jackhammer in my life, never. But I do have a good work ethic, I would like to think. And so basically after that job, they liked the way I work, so they ended up hiring me on. And I was in the apprenticeship, I was in the union, I was set. And it was more money than I was making ever before. It had a future, it had a career. At the time I thought I had a pension, I had school, I had insurance, I had all the things. But I couldn't help but say to myself, man, I did not want to be just a plumber. Is this what I'm going to be? I'm just going to be a plumber for the rest of my life? And the answer is no. You do not need to be just a plumber for the rest of your life if you don't want to. There's lots of opportunities out there once you get the foundation set. especially now with the way the industry is going. If you learn plumbing, get your foot in the door. Then you could transition, you can sidestep into something like management, like a service manager, or you could get into the marketing side. Consulting, education. You're not limited to just working with tools and fixing plumbing the rest of your life. It's a business, it's an industry. And once you have that foundation of your hands on the tools, Knowing what it takes being able to speak to guys in the field in their own language because you are one of them. It gives you a tremendous advantage to be able to sidestep to basically anything within the business world of plumbing especially education. Because even if you were to start tomorrow, four years from now, We would still need recruiting and we would still need to fill positions. This is not going to just fix itself overnight. It's going to take years, maybe decade plus, depending on who you listen to. This skilled trade gap is a huge problem and it's only going to get worse. And the public is only starting to become aware of it. And the first indicator is the prices in what we're charging, because it's not cheap and it's still going up. Alright, so if you have any other questions, send me an email, Brandon at ThatPlumbingPodcast. com send me your question, I will do the best I can to answer it. If you're interested in an apprenticeship and you're in the valley, like I said, there's a couple of companies that I know about. In about two months, right around the end of summer, the company that I'm working for, we're officially going to launch our apprenticeship program, so there'll be plenty of opportunities there, especially if you're a listener and you've been talking to me and you've shown initiative. That's going to be some of the first guys that I see if they're available when this thing opens up. Alright, that about does it for this episode, and I'm going to leave you with a question that you should probably contemplate if you're thinking about getting into an apprenticeship. And that question is, what would your life look like with a career that has security, stability, great home life balance. Making over six figures. What would you do with the money? What would you do with the time? With the stability? And if you choose residential service plumbing, what would you do with absolutely no income cap? Alright, thanks for listening. I hope to see y'all again next week.